Porn industry going through tough times., Free online content is cutting into the business. Rating Options

[Startha]

I guess I am glad I never got into Porn. I was told once that there are two things that always make money in a bad economy and one in a really bad economy. Sex and food in the bad economy and food in the really bad. So I guess the porn girls can move into escorting and still make a lot of money and if that doesnt work then open a restaurant down by Santa Monica and shut the fuck up LOL

[Angel2001]

Either you have a massive member base,

Why just the base of the cock?
(The rest is important too, you know.)

:-)

[seanchai]

A good topic and some well thought out answers. You all know my feelings about downloaded content and yes it HAS hurt the industry and the tgirl sites are hurting also, we've had to cut back in many places and adjust our business model to try and make all ends meet and continue to get a good product out. We've seen some big Biz2Biz companies fizzle in the last few months, including AVNOnline magazine which will be absorbed into AVN magazine ...
BUT ... it's not all to do with free porn.

The porn industries worst enemy, is the porn industry.
When you get companies with low integrity producing shitty content and trying to rip off customers, than the customer gets sick of it and starts to search out free porn, which as someone mentioned, quality free shemale porn takes a bit of work to get to, partly because of the efforts that Grooby and some of other TS companies do together.
I can see two banners on this site right now:
Bob's Tgirls ... operated by a guy who loves doing what he does, probably undercharges for what his site is worth and delivers exactly what he promises every month, to his subscribers.
Shemales Get Fucked ... a website that provides almost nothing yet rips off your credit card ... look at this text which is at the bottom of the page AFTER the "submit" button ...

"Your membership also includes free access to these sites:
One Thousand XXX Vids* Top Adult Pass **"






"* If not cancelled within the two day Free trial period, your subscription will automatically renew at thirty nine dollars ninety one cents per month.
** If not cancelled within the two day Free trial period, your subscription will automatically renew at thirty nine dollars ninety one cents per month."

Notice how they write the numbers out instead of 39.91 so your eye doesn't track it.
So the un-suspecting customer gets charged $108 per month, instead of what he planned to be $29.99.

How many times would you need to get ripped off before you say FUCK IT - and never join a porn site.
So why does Vicki have both these banners at the top of her page? Well Bob's banner will pay her $15 a join for as long as you stay a members (50% of 29.99) and the other site will pay her $100-$150 right away - they can do this because they've crunched the numbers and know most people wouldn't check their credit card statements until after they've been billed 2-3 times or more.

FACT 2.
Why do these illegal tube sites stay around with all the bandwidth they have to pay? Because they make money. They make money from sites like Shemales Get Fucked and Brazzers who just don't give a fuck and will pay advertising on tube sites regardless.


Consumers GENERALLY want to do the right thing. Most people on here appreciate what goes into running a site or a DVD and although they might look at some free porn are also purchasers. Those who would never pay for porn are a lost cause ... but they're generally failures in life anyway, so it's unlikely you'd ever convert them. What we need to do, is stop the people who would buy some porn, from being turned off from it altogether and only looking for free. We can do this by making sure they don't get ripped off and get what they want.

We know we're on the more expensive side, we're like that because to produce what we do, needs larger budgets and we need to do those productions, to keep the members in. N.American girls are expensive compared to models working at different economies so a site like Shemale Yum has to absorb those costs also. We've never been the highest paying company but we've been consistent and paid immediately after the shoots in cash and provided many models with ongoing work ... which we hope to do so.

What I'd like to say to everyone is, your correct, without a revenue stream there will be fewer productions and the worst part for me, is that few risks will be taken on new models. We may end up all looking at the same rehashed porn. So please, if you are a purchaser, take a good look at the sites that your considering joining, read the review sites, double check the billing terms and your credit card and be careful. There are plenty of quality sites out there that will give you what you are looking for as you help keep the TS porn industry alive.

Finally, take a look at our discounts at http://www.grooby.com/paybymail/ - check the "tickets" options at the top. Dealing directly with websites like ours should keep the costs down and the content up.

[BellaBellucci]

A good topic and some well thought out answers. You all know my feelings about downloaded content and yes it HAS hurt the industry and the tgirl sites are hurting also, we've had to cut back in many places and adjust our business model to try and make all ends meet and continue to get a good product out. We've seen some big Biz2Biz companies fizzle in the last few months, including AVNOnline magazine which will be absorbed into AVN magazine ...
BUT ... it's not all to do with free porn.

The porn industries worst enemy, is the porn industry.

Tempest and I had this exact same conversation earlier today but I like how you summed it up in one sentence. Classic! However, I have to disagree with your statement about talent development. What this niche of the industry needs is true crossover stars imho. Not just to cross into mainstream porn necessarily, but also into the mainstream entertainment or media industry. It's the marquee girls that have made studios like Playboy and Vivid what they are today and names like Jenna Jamison and Tera Patrick have become commonly known. We need more girls like that to move transsexuals into the mainstream, which certainly couldn't hurt business.

~BB~

[KylieA]

I can never see how these free sites can show full scenes and be profitable. I can't even show full scenes on my members' website without it pushing my bandwidth costs to a point that cuts deeply into my profitability. I would have thought that bandwidth and server space should have come down in price as bigger hard drives become cheaper, but the server guys are holding to 2005 prices. I imagine the free sites must own their own servers and generate ad revenue or something that's a windfall for them in a "moving traffic" sort of way, like tgflix.com (I don't really know how this works)

-Tara

The biggest cost to the web hosts is bandwidth. The second biggest cost is electricity.

A new server can had for a $620 from Dell. A 1TB hard drive is $100.

Let's power that server 24x7 for five years. Let's assume 100 watts(probably low). Another 33 watts for AC(Server rooms need year round AC). At $0.13 KWH, that works out to be $150/year. Or $750 for 5 years. Ouch.

You can argue about my electric costs, but power consumption is now a major factor in server purchases.

On to Band Width. The dawn of really really cheap band width.

The cost of band width is all about location location location.

I remember SETI and home scrambling for bandwidth around 2001. They where sucking down 50% of Berkley's T3 line(43Mb). Berkley was getting concerned. They wanted to charge SETI for costs. Something like $10,000/month. SETI found a new ISP in Palo Alto that was offering 100Mb internet service for $1000/month. 50 times cheaper. All they had to do was run a fiber from Berkley to Palo Alto. It turns Berkely already had one to Stanford.

What happened, why 50 times cheaper. The dark fiber collapse allowed small start ups to lease dark fibers between major US cities really cheap. With the dark fibers they could compete against the AT&T and Sprint backbone Internet service for pennies on the dollar.

The only caveat is that you had to be in cities like Palo Alto, New York City, etc. to take advantage of it.

All back to location location location. If your web hosts is big enough that it can move it's server room to Palo Alto, etc. or run a fiber to Palo Alto, etc. it's Internet costs will drop dramatically.

Even really big web sites like Google play in the dark fiber game.

-K

[mandy]

I guess I am glad I never got into Porn. I was told once that there are two things that always make money in a bad economy and one in a really bad economy. Sex and food in the bad economy and food in the really bad. So I guess the porn girls can move into escorting and still make a lot of money and if that doesnt work then open a restaurant down by Santa Monica and shut the fuck up LOL

Tell me about it. I hung out with a bunch of GG friends last night in SF who alternate between porn and hooking, everyone is making bank hooking and only the people who work at Kink are making money in porn (of my friends). Made me wonder if I ought to reconsider my decision to stop hooking.

[mandy]

I think now is the time to ramp it up, and make better product. It's definitely a producers market, every girl needs work. What that says to me is now is the time to produce more content not less. Supposedly supressing wages should boost production, I would be completely willing to shoot cheaper scenes in exchange for more work.

[seanchai]

A good topic and some well thought out answers. You all know my feelings about downloaded content and yes it HAS hurt the industry and the tgirl sites are hurting also, we've had to cut back in many places and adjust our business model to try and make all ends meet and continue to get a good product out. We've seen some big Biz2Biz companies fizzle in the last few months, including AVNOnline magazine which will be absorbed into AVN magazine ...
BUT ... it's not all to do with free porn.

The porn industries worst enemy, is the porn industry.

Tempest and I had this exact same conversation earlier today but I like how you summed it up in one sentence. Classic! However, I have to disagree with your statement about talent development. What this niche of the industry needs is true crossover stars imho. Not just to cross into mainstream porn necessarily, but also into the mainstream entertainment or media industry. It's the marquee girls that have made studios like Playboy and Vivid what they are today and names like Jenna Jamison and Tera Patrick have become commonly known. We need more girls like that to move transsexuals into the mainstream, which certainly couldn't hurt business.

~BB~

It will never happen - it's a pipe dream I've heard for years. Jenna Jameson and Tera might be well known but only for their porn achievements, not into mainstream entertainment.
Also the ongoing ... why no transsexuals in mainstream porn ... because it's not that buyers market!!! I've heard this time and time again of girls also ... why would you expect to make a jump into mainstream anymore than you'd expect a BBW, MILF Black model to appear in a DVD featuring All-White Teens?

Time for a reality check people! This is what is is.
By all means, if you want to chase your dream then go for it but don't expect to make a jump from transsexual porn to being a mainstream porn star or into mainstream entertainment.

[seanchai]

I think now is the time to ramp it up, and make better product. It's definitely a producers market, every girl needs work. What that says to me is now is the time to produce more content not less. Supposedly supressing wages should boost production, I would be completely willing to shoot cheaper scenes in exchange for more work.

Good thoughts Mandy and I agree product should be improving. However, as you know, the model fee is only part of a studio cost and I just don't see many companies being able to invest in the sort of mega-quality that this genre deserves.

[BellaBellucci]

It will never happen - it's a pipe dream I've heard for years. Jenna Jameson and Tera might be well known but only for their porn achievements, not into mainstream entertainment.
Also the ongoing ... why no transsexuals in mainstream porn ... because it's not that buyers market!!! I've heard this time and time again of girls also ... why would you expect to make a jump into mainstream anymore than you'd expect a BBW, MILF Black model to appear in a DVD featuring All-White Teens?

Time for a reality check people! This is what is is.
By all means, if you want to chase your dream then go for it but don't expect to make a jump from transsexual porn to being a mainstream porn star or into mainstream entertainment.

I see your point about mainstream porn, but I disagree on what a transsexual woman is capable of in the mainstream entertainment world. We're already starting to see TS women on TV and in movies - maybe not as much as some of us would like but these things take time of course. You don't think there can be a TS woman in the business who is attractive and talented outside of just being able to take her clothes off? Just because she may get her first exposure from doing so, that doesn't mean she's necessarily limited to it. I hope something happens within our society to change your mind on this.

~BB~

[seanchai]

It will never happen - it's a pipe dream I've heard for years. Jenna Jameson and Tera might be well known but only for their porn achievements, not into mainstream entertainment.
Also the ongoing ... why no transsexuals in mainstream porn ... because it's not that buyers market!!! I've heard this time and time again of girls also ... why would you expect to make a jump into mainstream anymore than you'd expect a BBW, MILF Black model to appear in a DVD featuring All-White Teens?

Time for a reality check people! This is what is is.
By all means, if you want to chase your dream then go for it but don't expect to make a jump from transsexual porn to being a mainstream porn star or into mainstream entertainment.

I see your point about mainstream porn, but I disagree on what a transsexual woman is capable of in the mainstream entertainment world. We're already starting to see TS women on TV and in movies - maybe not as much as some of us would like but these things take time of course. You don't think there can be a TS woman in the business who is attractive and talented outside of just being able to take her clothes off? Just because she may get her first exposure from doing so, that doesn't mean she's necessarily limited to it. I hope something happens within our society to change your mind on this.

~BB~

No you mis-interpreted what I stated.
There are opportunities for TG women in mainstream entertainment and we're seeing more avenues in 2009 than any time that I can remember. However, I think using the porn industry as a spring board to crossover into that, is mis-guided and won't happen. It didn't happen for the mainstream porn world, it won't happen for the transgender porn world.
An individual who is series about wanting to work in mainstream entertainment (and I've barely met a handful who have the talent or the ambition to follow it through ... the same as I wanted to be an astronaut when I grew up) should very seriously consider the implications of working in the adult industry first.

[mandy]

I think now is the time to ramp it up, and make better product. It's definitely a producers market, every girl needs work. What that says to me is now is the time to produce more content not less. Supposedly supressing wages should boost production, I would be completely willing to shoot cheaper scenes in exchange for more work.

Good thoughts Mandy and I agree product should be improving. However, as you know, the model fee is only part of a studio cost and I just don't see many companies being able to invest in the sort of mega-quality that this genre deserves.

I guess what I'm saying is that now is a time to invest what is majorly lacking in tranny porn (which in my mind is not just money), mainly creativity. It's time to put some thought into the scenes that are being created. I predict, the adult industry may collapse but some of the absolute best TS porn movies will be released in the next couple years. Less money means people have to work harder, not just throw cash around.

[seanchai]

I guess what I'm saying is that now is a time to invest what is majorly lacking in tranny porn (which in my mind is not just money), mainly creativity. It's time to put some thought into the scenes that are being created. I predict, the adult industry may collapse but some of the absolute best TS porn movies will be released in the next couple years. Less money means people have to work harder, not just throw cash around.

If only everyone could think that way! The cold fact is that many models won't work for less because as you stated, most of them can escort for better pay. We're lucky in a way that we've always concentrated on many non-stereotypical "tranny" performers, like yourself, and many of them bring their own ideas and creativity to the table and are prepared to work with us, for a good product as well as the paycheck - which doesn't have to be mutually exclusive.

This post has been edited by seanchai: Aug 14 2009, 11:05 PM

[MostlyBlindFate]

I guess what I'm saying is that now is a time to invest what is majorly lacking in tranny porn (which in my mind is not just money), mainly creativity. It's time to put some thought into the scenes that are being created. I predict, the adult industry may collapse but some of the absolute best TS porn movies will be released in the next couple years. Less money means people have to work harder, not just throw cash around.

If only everyone could think that way! The cold fact is that many models won't work for less because as you stated, most of them can escort for better pay. We're lucky in a way that we've always concentrated on many non-stereotypical "tranny" performers, like yourself, and many of them bring their own ideas and creativity to the table and are prepared to work with us, for a good product as well as the paycheck - which doesn't have to be mutually exclusive.

I don't think that's happening. simply, bc there isnt a profitable market for it. Sure, I would like qualitiy stuff myself, that's why I would never use those trany tube sites - simply bc of poor quality! But plenty of guys just dont care much bout quality. Besides, as stated earlier, there is plenty of good old material out there already.

Porn isnt about creativity, it's about jerking off. For many porn consumers creativity doesnt mean shit.

Of course, you would have to try things out before making a solid statement on the matter. I have the gut feeling though it won't happen.

This post has been edited by MostlyBlindFate: Aug 14 2009, 11:25 PM

[Walsh]

The times are really changing fast in a lot of ways for business. I said to a friend of mine, this is a modern day evolution for all forms of entertainment and media. And you know how evolution in these fields works. You either adapt or you become extinct.

I live in a mid-size town and for years we had ONE family owed video store and the Blockbuster. I knew the ppl that owned and ran both places really well being the movie and entertainment guy that I am.

Over the last few years, the family owned store expanded the porn section like crazy in hopes of making most of their money that way. I hadn't been there in over a year, but the last time I was, the "back room" was so big it over shadowed the mainstream part of the store. But I could see within the last four years as a regular mainstream video store, business was really slow and they were hurting.

Well last night when I was running errands, I was saddened to see that this mom and pop store had shut it's doors and there was a huge "For Lease" sign out front. I'm surprised they stayed around as long as they did.

This family also owns a bunch of other stores in the same strip mall. I popped in there to tell them I was sorry to see them out of business as it was an end of an era to me.

The woman thanked me and told me there was no way anyone these days can keep up with stuff like Netflix, XrentDVD, and the free adult sites. In this day and age, there is no need to go to a video store. And ppl can save so much money, time, and gas renting movies from home for a flat rate instead of buying.

Hell, a few months ago I read a business report that said the almighty Blockbuster was worried that THEY may even be out of business by the end of 2011 because Netflix was putting such a dent into them. For sure they will be closing tons of stores over the next few years as a result.